+- THE SOCIAL UNDERGROUND COMMUNITY (https://www.socialunderground.com/forums)
+-- Forum: Boxing (/forumdisplay.php?fid=3)
+--- Forum: Boxing Unfiltered (/forumdisplay.php?fid=5)
+--- Thread: Cotto-Margarito II PPV Discussion Thread (/showthread.php?tid=249)
Cotto-Margarito II PPV Discussion Thread - Method - 12-05-2011 12:06 AM
KYLE THEEE SPINKS FAN Wrote:Yea, the opinions are pretty much set in stone. I agree Method, I didn't see this total beatdown either. I saw Cotto holding on half the time, and running from corner to corner from the 3rd round on. Sure, he landed some nice shots, but by no means was this complete domination. Tony backed him up and landed a lot of body shots. People can think what they want about plaster being involved in the first fight. However, there were markings all over Cotto's face. It's not like those got their by accident.Team Margarito already pushing for a rubber match in Mexico City.
No, Cotto did not hold as much as Andre Berto. However, he did hold more than usual. I'm not going to rag on Cotto for that though, since the ref let it happen. If the ref lets it happen, it is what it is. It worked for his favor and good for him. Who knows what happens in those last three rounds. I don't think he would have stopped him personally, since Cotto was doing a solid job of clinching. Even if he got hurt, he would have hung on for dear life to survive. However, Margarito had a strong round 9 and landed 25 power shots.
Who knows, maybe they can have a trilogy in Vegas or LA. I don't think Margarito would take the fight if it were offered in NYC again. Cotto probably won't get the Pacquiao rematch, and there really is no point for it either. If PPV numbers were good, and Arum made a decent amount of money, he'll try to make the fight again.
Will never happen. Would love it, only if the eye could hold up (which it can't), but I would love it.
Marg would also need to learn to keep the chin tucked and his guard higher. Damn. He could done himself a few favors by holding that rt hand up.
Cotto-Margarito II PPV Discussion Thread - and the NEW - 12-05-2011 12:11 AM
Method Wrote:KYLE THEEE SPINKS FAN Wrote:Yea, the opinions are pretty much set in stone. I agree Method, I didn't see this total beatdown either. I saw Cotto holding on half the time, and running from corner to corner from the 3rd round on. Sure, he landed some nice shots, but by no means was this complete domination. Tony backed him up and landed a lot of body shots. People can think what they want about plaster being involved in the first fight. However, there were markings all over Cotto's face. It's not like those got their by accident.Team Margarito already pushing for a rubber match in Mexico City.
No, Cotto did not hold as much as Andre Berto. However, he did hold more than usual. I'm not going to rag on Cotto for that though, since the ref let it happen. If the ref lets it happen, it is what it is. It worked for his favor and good for him. Who knows what happens in those last three rounds. I don't think he would have stopped him personally, since Cotto was doing a solid job of clinching. Even if he got hurt, he would have hung on for dear life to survive. However, Margarito had a strong round 9 and landed 25 power shots.
Who knows, maybe they can have a trilogy in Vegas or LA. I don't think Margarito would take the fight if it were offered in NYC again. Cotto probably won't get the Pacquiao rematch, and there really is no point for it either. If PPV numbers were good, and Arum made a decent amount of money, he'll try to make the fight again.
Will never happen. Would love it, only if the eye could hold up (which it can't), but I would love it.
Marg would also need to learn to keep the chin tucked and his guard higher. Damn. He could done himself a few favors by holding that rt hand up.
Yeh, that's what I was saying the whole time! WTF was he doing, he didn't even try to protect his eye!
Cotto-Margarito II PPV Discussion Thread - Snoop - 12-05-2011 12:26 AM
I wasn't talking about end of fight comparisons. I'm talking about end of round 9 vs end of round 9 between the two fights. I guess pics would be hard to conjure up, but from what I remember, his face looked a lot more fucked up in the first fight via 9 rds than this one.
But sure, let's throw out the face argument and just look at body language/demeanor. Cotto appeared way more confident going into the 10th than he did the first fight, and figured out a way to neutralize Margarito's attack. None of us can say for sure what would have happened if the fight would have kept going, but my guess is more of the same: Cotto left hook, clinch, move, left hook.
Either way, up to 9 rounds, 1st fight vs 2nd fight, the condition of Cotto, however you wanna measure it, was different. Either Marg had something in his gloves that first fight, or the 2nd fight wasn't going the same way as the first.
Cotto-Margarito II PPV Discussion Thread - Fitz - 12-05-2011 01:26 AM
I was wrong about the fight to, thought Margarito was going to butcher Cotto and put a bit of money on that. I was wrong, and I couldn't be happier about it.
Don't know if it's a coincidence or not, but the few people that didn't think it was a beatdown or saw something different to what others saw, were the same Margarito supporters before the fight and the ones that thought he would slaughter Cotto. Talking about Method, JD and Kyle mainly, though JD hasn't been quite as vocal yet.
I just don't see similarities between the first and second fight. Sure Cotto's face was marked up, but Cotto was in a different place mentally at the same point compared to the first fight, was dominating at that point unlike the first fight and had more life in him up until that point.
Cotto-Margarito II PPV Discussion Thread - Warlord - 12-05-2011 03:40 AM
Hey guys, sorry I'm late to the party. Didn't forget about you though. The best thing about Cotto/Margarito II was Cotto's wife's titties bouncing around as she was crying and then later clapping.
Cotto is a true champion of humanity for bringing his wife to the ring dressed like that. What a hero.
Cotto-Margarito II PPV Discussion Thread - MrFactor - 12-05-2011 03:42 AM
To me, this fight was similar to the first. The differences were of course 'The EYE' and Cotto's clinching when in close. Margarito was the same take two and smile while killing Cotto's Body. Cotto would have limped to the finish due to his clinching this time around. He would not have survived a 15 rounder if this was back in the day. Though he won, he was wilting in my opinion. I dont think we have the closure for the han rap situatrion that many of us were banking on, especially MAX KELLERMAN. He was so dead set on Margarito's punches not having the same effect on Cotto. I dont agree. Cottos face was starting to show similar welting. Cotto clearly didnt like the body shots. Due to Cotto's clinches, Margarito didnt appear to be landing at the same rate because of the little tweaks Cotto made.
Cotto-Margarito II PPV Discussion Thread - Fitz - 12-05-2011 04:07 AM
I think Max was right, Margarito's punching did not have the same effect on Cotto. I don't think Cotto was seriously buzzed at all last night, and seemed to take his shots better as well than the first time.
Cotto-Margarito II PPV Discussion Thread - Lil-Lightsout - 12-05-2011 04:20 AM
Method Wrote:A "total beatdown".Many of us in here had it a shut-out or only giving Margs 1 round, to me that is domination and a total beat down. Sorry bro but I honestly saw this and so did others too. And in fact more saw it that way than any other way, in here at least I gather.
Unbelievable.
Damn.
You know what? People that keep coming in here repeating the same shit....you're right. Their not gonna change their minds. Im blown away about deranged their view of the fight.
You don't look as fucked up as Cotto did administering a total beatdown. Shit, Cotto looked WORSE than Margarito, save for the fucked eye. Tell me different.
AND I completely agree with Fitz said above, about suggesting if it is a coincidence about guys like you and Kyle, and JD(though he has not said much after) being huge supporters of Margarito slaughtering Cotto beforehand, and now you guys not seeing the same fight most of us saw.
You are right, I refuse to change my "deranged view", I know what I saw and it was domination and Margarito practically getting shut out. And I saw nothing from Margarito to suggest he was going to change anything in the next 3 rounds.
The first and second fights were not similar at all to me, not even close.
Also...ALL 3 judges had the fight 89-82 going into the 10th round! So all 3 official judges only gave Margarito one round. Please explain that??? We all know how screwy scoring is in this shady game, BUT all thre judges were in agreement with this fight, which were in agreement with many of us on here. That speaks volumes of what fight they were watching too, domination by Cotto.
Cotto-Margarito II PPV Discussion Thread - Lil-Lightsout - 12-05-2011 04:23 AM
Fitz Wrote:I was wrong about the fight to, thought Margarito was going to butcher Cotto and put a bit of money on that. I was wrong, and I couldn't be happier about it.This is what I mean. I totally agree with this above.
Don't know if it's a coincidence or not, but the few people that didn't think it was a beatdown or saw something different to what others saw, were the same Margarito supporters before the fight and the ones that thought he would slaughter Cotto. Talking about Method, JD and Kyle mainly, though JD hasn't been quite as vocal yet.
I just don't see similarities between the first and second fight. Sure Cotto's face was marked up, but Cotto was in a different place mentally at the same point compared to the first fight, was dominating at that point unlike the first fight and had more life in him up until that point.
Kyle- You sound disgruntled to me, I am getting a chuckle reading.
Cotto-Margarito II PPV Discussion Thread - Fitz - 12-05-2011 05:09 AM
I can see what Method, JD, Kyle and now Mr Factor(?) are getting at. That Cotto was tiring and his face was getting marked up. But those things seem so small when you then notice the differences from the second fight.
Sure, similarities on the first fight up until round 9-10are:
- Cotto tiring (not as bad as the first fight)
- Cotto's face getting marked up (not as bad as the first fight)
Differences on the first fight up until round 9-10
- Cotto arguably pitching a shut out (Margarito needing a knockout to win at least), while the first fight, it was close and could possibly be going either way
- Cotto having more in the tank up until that point
- Cotto learning to clinch and tie up which was previously non-existent which was a reason why he had more in the tank. His defence was to get on his bike previously, and that can only be kept up for so long. Cotto would be clinching when becoming gassed now. Rather than run and take a knee through exhaustion like he did in the first fight.
- Margarito's eye was battered
- Cotto's whole demeanour and attitude was positive, confident and very relaxed the whole way through last night and never once did it change. You did not see that at this stage of the first fight, Cotto looked desperate previously. I think this play a HUGE factor. I think the mental makeup of a fighter (this can go with just about anything) is make or break.
What they are saying might be true, but the differences outweigh some of the similarities. It feels like some of the other stuff is being ignored.
I just saw enough of the fight where I don't wonder about the what if's of the last 3 rounds.