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+--- Thread: Should draws be eliminated in boxing? (/showthread.php?tid=668)
Should draws be eliminated in boxing? - BrutalBodyShots - 05-28-2012 05:06 PM
Both sides can be argued. For me personally, draws are anti-climactic and leave me unfulfilled. I want a winner. Sure, they almost always mean a rematch - which is the only real positive of draws in boxing in my estimation. Almost every other sport has some means of giving us a clear winner at the end. Sudden death. Tie breakers. Over time. Whatever. Why not boxing?
So here are a few ideas just to get some discussion going here. Not saying I agree with all of these ideas but they are potential solutions to either eliminate the draw or at least decrease its likelihood.
Odd number of rounds: Having an odd number of rounds (like UFC for example) decreases the chances of us getting a draw at the end of a fight. Sure with point deductions it can still happen, but significantly less often. I know 11 round or 13 round fights sound bogus since it's not something we're used to, but couldn't they help?
Revamped 10 point must system scoring: Rounds where one guy clearly wins the round should be scored 10-8, not 10-9. In the current system aside from a knock down you have to completely dominate and have your opponent reeling for a good portion of the round to get it scored 10-8 for the most part. What if 10-8 rounds became common for every round where the judge felt one guy CLEARLY won the round, and 10-9 rounds were only used in close, competitive rounds that they feel one guy only slightly won? A knockdown would then be a 10-7 round. I look at it this way. In a 12 round fight if one guy clearly wins the first 6 rounds without question, then the other turns the tide and only SLIGHTLY wins the next 6 rounds in our current system we get a 114-114 score. If we look at this alternate scoring system the first guy would have six 10-8 rounds and the other six 10-9 rounds resulting in an overall score of 114-108, resulting in a clear winner. In a Mayweather-Cotto type fight you'd have more 10-9 rounds where in a Froch-Bute fight you've have basically all 10-8 rounds.
Some sort of draw-breaking battle in the event of a draw: Maybe if the judges cards were tallied THROUGHOUT the fight (not just at the end) and their decision could be seen within 30 seconds of a bout ending, if a fight were declared a draw the fight could continue. I don't know, how about 3 more rounds? An odd number would likely give us a winner after those 3. If the decision was rendered quickly enough, round 13 could essentially start within the 1 minute time frame in between rounds. Who knows.
Anyway just some ideas guys. I'd like to hear some more from the rest of you.
Should draws be eliminated in boxing? - Fitz - 05-28-2012 06:41 PM
Sorry, but never agreed with eliminating 'draws' in any sport, unless it's finals time and you need to find a winner.
I agree, a lot of people find it anti-climatic and sometimes it can be. But to me, if nobody deserves the win, and nobody has clearly won in the allocated time then a draw is the suitable result.
I don't agree in 'trying' to find a winner. If a winner doesn't emerge in the allocated time, then a draw is the correct result, even if it is anti-climatic. That's just my view, as I believe draws should exist.
Should draws be eliminated in boxing? - BrotherCane - 05-28-2012 06:51 PM
I don't think draws should be eliminated especially when they are actually draws! Making where fights are scored better would be a great start and if draws is an issue either do 15 round fights or even 13 rounds for belts and 11 rounds for non title bouts! shrugs
Should draws be eliminated in boxing? - Spyder - 05-28-2012 07:29 PM
I think that judges should be eliminated. Let the guys fight it out the those crazy pikeys, until one of them has had enough.
Should draws be eliminated in boxing? - BrutalBodyShots - 05-28-2012 08:13 PM
Spyder Wrote:I think that judges should be eliminated. Let the guys fight it out the those crazy pikeys, until one of them has had enough.That's kind of what I like about the old days - no draws... the fight goes on until there's a clear winner. I completely understand that the likelihood for serious injuries and long term damage increases as the length of a fight increases and get why fight have been shortened in the last 100 years.
Should draws be eliminated in boxing? - Romulus9 - 05-28-2012 08:15 PM
Shouldn't have eliminated 15 rounders.
Should draws be eliminated in boxing? - BrutalBodyShots - 05-28-2012 08:26 PM
Also another thing to consider is with less than stellar judging, half the time we hear a result rendered as a draw we as the viewing community as a whole (fans, writers, etc) many times as a consensus have already declared a winner. In such a case, if the fight were to continue and the judges had to score say another 3 rounds there would be greater chance that they'd return a verdict that agrees with the otherwise disagreeing, unsatisfied fans.
Take a fight like Lewis-Holyfield I. Had that fight been extended another 3 rounds chances are that Lewis would have received the close decision win, 143-142 which while WAY to close of a score for most of our liking would have at least resulted in the right man having his hand raised... not an anti climactic draw.
Fitz what about the revised scoring system I proposed (which would still allow draws, just make them less frequent). The current system to me just doesn't make sense. A guy can dominate a round and get a 10-9 score on all 3 cards, then in the following round the other guy edges the round and gets the same score? This is why many times we as fans "feel" like one guy deserves to win, but with the present scoring system end up with the wrong winner. IMO if a guy wins 5 dominant rounds in a fight (he outlands the opponent 20-5 in each round) compared to the other barely winning 7 lackluster rounds (he outlands the opponent 15-10), the guy that did a ton of damage in the 5 should be able to win. The landed punches would support that with the first guy outlanding the other 180-120 even though he lost in rounds 5-7. Again, just numbers for the sake of discussion.
Should draws be eliminated in boxing? - BrutalBodyShots - 05-28-2012 08:30 PM
Romulus9 Wrote:Shouldn't have eliminated 15 rounders.I tend to agree. Or it should have been lowered from 15 to 13. I wonder if the powers that be that decided to lower fights from 15 to 12 rounds realized that they were going to create a lot more draws by doing so.
I think the corner should have the say on if a fight gets stopped because of too much damage being incurred. All fights are different; you can have a guy like Bute take more damage in 4-5 rounds like we just saw than a guy like Mayweather takes going the distance. Depending on the fighters there could be fights that go 20 rounds that are "safer" than Gatti-Ward type fighters going a fraction of that distance.
Should draws be eliminated in boxing? - torvix2000 - 05-28-2012 08:35 PM
Draws should not be eliminated and for championship fights no more champion from drawn result.
Should draws be eliminated in boxing? - Fitz - 05-28-2012 08:47 PM
BrutalBodyShots Wrote:Fitz what about the revised scoring system I proposed (which would still allow draws, just make them less frequent). The current system to me just doesn't make sense. A guy can dominate a round and get a 10-9 score on all 3 cards, then in the following round the other guy edges the round and gets the same score? This is why many times we as fans "feel" like one guy deserves to win, but with the present scoring system end up with the wrong winner. IMO if a guy wins 5 dominant rounds in a fight (he outlands the opponent 20-5 in each round) compared to the other barely winning 7 lackluster rounds (he outlands the opponent 15-10), the guy that did a ton of damage in the 5 should be able to win. The landed punches would support that with the first guy outlanding the other 180-120 even though he lost in rounds 5-7. Again, just numbers for the sake of discussion.I don't have a problem if it's an odd number of rounds to decrease the chances of a draw. I just wouldn't like a solution to eliminate them all together if we do happen to have a draw.
I also hear you about the scoring, and I have wondered the same thing as you before. Because I have scored fights for guys that scraped close rounds, and lost clearly in the ones he lost, and I am sometimes in the minority.
I have changed my stance over the years though, as I too though the scoring would be better off to be changed, but I think the problem is just the corruption. I think with compotent judging, the current system will 'usually' reward the correct guy, but it's the corruption. I just think no matter how you score a boxing fight, the judges will always find a way to fuck things up and that will always be the case when corruption is around.
But I am going off topic a little. If I was to be given a solution to minimise 'draws'. I think I'd make fights 13 rounds instead.