Fights Revisited. Felix Trinidad-Fernando Vargas

[ViperSniper]

What a fight! Just finished watching this and was a much better fight than I remembered.

The fight was very strange in terms of scoring, the flow and the way it was officiated by non other than Jay Nady who over did his job.

People have always gone on about Trinidad's left hook..but his right hand was brutal! First round sees that punch buckle Vargas which lead to the first knockdown..and the next. Vargas was rocked badly and did well to survive..but was maybe lucky too that Trinidad wasn't able to step it up enough to get the job done.

Vargas spends the next couple of rounds regrouping and start landing the occasional clean shot. By the middle rounds Vargas is able to step it up, land clean shots more frequently and drops Trinidad himself in the middle rounds.

Trinidad showed some real desperation after beating the count by blatantly going south to give him some critical recovery time. Smart? Dirty? It was a game changing moment that saw Trinidad get a point deduction to make it a 10-7 round.

By this point the fight had heated up with both fighters landing some clean, hard shots and more low blows that saw Vargas take less time for each penalty gone by.

By the late rounds Vargas is starting to tire and to make matters worse gets a point deduction himself. Championship rounds arrive and Trinidad appears to be getting stronger while at this point Vargas has taken a beating in the last couple of rounds and is showing the effects.

12th and final round arrives and the crowd has not stopped going nuts (terrific atmosphere) & Vargas needs a knockout to win(had him down by 2points), not to mention the 3 minutes he has to stay on his feet. Trinidad catches Vargas with a big left hook that sees Vargas's head snap around and falls back, crashing to the canvas. Fernando does a great job of beating the count but eventually gets tagged with a massive right, from a clinch to see him tip over to end the fight.

Great, tough, heated unification fight between two undefeated champions who fought with a lot of intensity.

[BrutalBodyShots]

Certainly a great fight between two undefeated fighters both in their prime.

That first round was really disastrous for Vargas and completely changed the outcome of the fight IMO. Not only did it put Vargas in a massive deficit in terms of scoring, but physically it took a ton out of him. Trinidad was a brutal puncher, probably had his illegal wraps on and caught Vargas CLEAN multiple times. Vargas squinting from those vicious power shots reminded me a little bit of McClellan throughout the 10th round of his fight with Benn and when he was on a knee taking the final 10-count ending the fight. You could tell McClellan had taken some permanent damage in that fight, and I felt that way about Vargas and it had only been 1 round.

I always thought that Trinidad was really hurt from that left hook from Vargas that put him on his ass, and that Trinidad hit him low to buy some time when the action resumed. While I do believe that the low blow was intentional, having watched the fight probably 10 times since then I don't think Trinidad was as hurt as I thought when seeing it live or even after a few times watching it. I originally thought that had Trinidad not hit Vargas low to buy some time that Vargas would have been able to finish him. Having watched it a ton more times I think that Trinidad would have survived Vargas' follow up regardless as he was up quickly, had his legs and wits about him and recovered really fast.

For me, round 1 was the difference in the fight. Had Vargas not gotten caught so early with those clean shots, not only does the fight WITHOUT QUESTION go the distance but also scoring wise Vargas probably edges it out on the cards. Vargas in most of his losses faded toward the end of the fight, which may well still have been the case with Trinidad without the horrific round 1, but I think he would have had enough left in the tank and would have built enough of a lead to still take a decision even losing rounds 11 and 12.

Vargas has got to hate rewatching that first round, the same way Marquez probably hates watching round 1 of his first fight with Pacquiao.

[jlupi]

Yeah and vargas legs were not great for the majority fight. 1st rd goes a little different it becomes an entirely diff fight.

[Mean Mister Mustard]

This was a truly memorable night. There's something about big fights taking place at the end of the year that always makes it more epic for me.

Tat first round definitely ruined Vargas for the rest of the fight, but I suspect that he would have been caught again at some point in the fight.

Going into the fight I really though Vargas would outbox Trinidad, but in hindsight, Trinidad was older, had more experience and had fought the better competition. Vargas demonstrated great composure by coming back and giving Tito hell, but I was surprised at how inconsistent his defense was. In some spots he displayed beautiful ducking and slipping skills but once he lengthened the distance he would get caught with jabs and right hands. It seems like he couldn't roll with the shots.

In the end this remains Trinidad's best performance and it really cemented him as the best puncher in the game at that time.

[the ollie reed fan club]

(10-01-2014 10:45 PM)Mean Mister Mustard Wrote:  This was a truly memorable night. There's something about big fights taking place at the end of the year that always makes it more epic for me.

Tat first round definitely ruined Vargas for the rest of the fight, but I suspect that he would have been caught again at some point in the fight.

Going into the fight I really though Vargas would outbox Trinidad, but in hindsight, Trinidad was older, had more experience and had fought the better competition. Vargas demonstrated great composure by coming back and giving Tito hell, but I was surprised at how inconsistent his defense was. In some spots he displayed beautiful ducking and slipping skills but once he lengthened the distance he would get caught with jabs and right hands. It seems like he couldn't roll with the shots.

In the end this remains Trinidad's best performance and it really cemented him as the best puncher in the game at that time.

Are you having a joke here?

[ViperSniper]

I agree Brutal. Having a "disastrous" first round is exactly what Vargas had. Vargas would have not only been badly hurt but very overwhelmed, in shock, confused and would have had a whole bunch of doubt to finishing the very first round of the biggest fight of his life! Round 1 fucked the rest of the fight for Vargas. I too noticed the squinting of Fernando, he got clubbed in the first and batter till the final. It's safe to say his career was dramatically shortened by this fight!

[Mean Mister Mustard]

(10-01-2014 10:58 PM)the ollie reed fan club Wrote:  

(10-01-2014 10:45 PM)Mean Mister Mustard Wrote:  This was a truly memorable night. There's something about big fights taking place at the end of the year that always makes it more epic for me.

Tat first round definitely ruined Vargas for the rest of the fight, but I suspect that he would have been caught again at some point in the fight.

Going into the fight I really though Vargas would outbox Trinidad, but in hindsight, Trinidad was older, had more experience and had fought the better competition. Vargas demonstrated great composure by coming back and giving Tito hell, but I was surprised at how inconsistent his defense was. In some spots he displayed beautiful ducking and slipping skills but once he lengthened the distance he would get caught with jabs and right hands. It seems like he couldn't roll with the shots.

In the end this remains Trinidad's best performance and it really cemented him as the best puncher in the game at that time.

Are you having a joke here?

Haha, I didn't even notice it.

I don't know if Trinidad's wraps really made a difference. I know that for a longtime afterwards I was bitter about Vargas losing and would reference Trinidad's wraps as a result. Still, if the wraps did make a difference, I still think Trinidad would have beaten him. He was catching Vargas a lot.

Speaking of the wraps, anyone remember that CSI once referenced Trinidad and his wraps? I never watched the show, but I remember someone mentioning it back in the old boards.

---

[BrutalBodyShots]

(10-01-2014 10:45 PM)Mean Mister Mustard Wrote:  Tat first round definitely ruined Vargas for the rest of the fight, but I suspect that he would have been caught again at some point in the fight.

You're probably right, but getting caught clean multiple times in the first is much different than getting caught clean later on. That's why often guys later in a fight don't go down from shots they went down from earlier. Getting caught cold really magnifies things early on. We saw it when Marquez got dropped by Pacquiao 3 times in the first but took Pacquiao's shots much better as the fight went on. The most recent example I can think of is Martinez getting caught cold and dropped by Cotto 3 times in the first. Another disastrous first round, but Martinez was able to take his shots better toward the middle rounds.

That first round against Trinidad really fucked Vargas up. I think he was dropped with that first huge left hook about 30 seconds into the fight and I know the second knockdown was within the first half of the round. Vargas then fought the remainder of the round pretty well and didn't get hurt again, but even with that minute and a half of recoop time where he wasn't significantly caught again and seemed to have his legs back he went to a neutral corner when the round ended, further proof that he was seriously rattled in the head from those first 2 huge left hooks early.

[blackbelt2003]

Wow. We need a Tito right now. Money, Ward and Rigo are terrific boxers, but I want an elite level puncher. Please please please let GGG be the one.



Black

[and the NEW]

(10-03-2014 02:51 AM)blackbelt2003 Wrote:  Wow. We need a Tito right now. Money, Ward and Rigo are terrific boxers, but I want an elite level puncher. Please please please let GGG be the one.

Black

Yeah, it is great to watch the wizard technicians, but a great power puncher is also something else to behold.

I think GGG definitely has the talent to be a HOF fighter, but he just isn't as enjoyable to watch. His robotic movements don't make him pleasing to the eye (which is why I suspect so many severely underrate his skills).

As for the Tito vs Vargas fight. Epic. I thought Vargas would take Tito's shot, given he stood up to Quartey with ease and even bullied him around for a lot of their fight. Trinidad's power was incredible though, you don't often see fighters commit to their shots like he did. It made him very one dimensional, but from 154 down, that was a heck of a dimension! Unfortunately Trinidad didn't use a great strength and conditioning coach to take him up the divisions, he just ate himself up there.