Mayweather fights on May 5th

[STEVENSKI]

Fitz Wrote:One handed fighter? He was, but I saw promising signs and he was using his right hand beautifully in his last fight and added that to his arsenal.

C'mon Fitz. He was using his right hand against Margarito who is a very different fighter to Floyd. I can see what you are saying & I think that Cotto does have the potential to cause PBF some problems but his "promising" right hand development was against guys that are very different fighters to PBF.

That said Cotto is more deserving than the other fighters being bandied about as PBF opponents.

[Fitz]

the ollie reed fan club Wrote:Mayorga??? :surprise: Haha you're joking right? Mayo finished the fight on his feet and feigning a hand injury. When I think of getting stretched I'm thinking of what Mosley did to him.

Finishing the fight on your feet is not getting clocked with one punch.

I thought the last round of the second Margarito fight was Tony's best round of the night. Yes I still gave it to Cotto but I also saw enough to think to myself this could get interesting if they allow it too continue (which they didn't.)

Gee I'm really hoping the fight with PBF gets made. You've let your love for Cotto trip you up a couple of times before.

I was just answering the question. He ended the fight with one punch. Whether Mayorga could have gotten up is another story, but he hurt and dropped Mayorga with a single shot, who has a much better chin than Mayweather. Mayorga was hurt, you just don't quit in the 12th round like that, lol.

That was maybe his best round, but he lost the round easily and got beaten and abused at the end of the round with Cotto finishing strong. It just doesn't make sense to me that the guy who ended the fight stronger is the one with question marks.

Also I agree, Mosley hits harder than Cotto, but then again, I also think Cotto hits harder than Corley. I don't think it's likely Cotto ends it, I just don't know how it can be ruled out entirely. You honestly don't think Cotto can hurt or end a fight with Mayweather, if he landed the perfect punch?

I've been tripped with the Pacquiao fight, nobody knew Pacquiao was like that until that fight. I have no shame in picking Cotto. Though you didn't mention me picking Margarito in the rematch, lol.

I don't let 'love' trip me up. I may be wrong with my picks, but it's not because of my like for a certain fighter that makes me see blindly.
I have picked against my favourite fighters countless times. Hopkins is the perfect example.

[Fitz]

STEVENSKI Wrote:C'mon Fitz. He was using his right hand against Margarito who is a very different fighter to Floyd. I can see what you are saying & I think that Cotto does have the potential to cause PBF some problems but his "promising" right hand development was against guys that are very different fighters to PBF.

That said Cotto is more deserving than the other fighters being bandied about as PBF opponents.

That doesn't matter. I know it's not Mayweather he was in against but it has nothing to do with Mayweather.

JD was talking on Cotto's skillset (no mention of opponent) and said he is a one handed fighter. I said that it is true, but there were promising signs and he was using his right hand a lot in his last fight. That's all I can comment on for now, on what I have seen.
Doesn't mean he will be successful, but it's promising, much like the other adjustments he has made recently.

[STEVENSKI]

That is a fair point Fitz. I would give Cotto no more than a 10% chance to beat mayweather but he would have a chance. I also think Cotto is probably the most deserving opponent bar Pac & Martinez.

[JD]

Fitz Wrote:

JD Wrote:Going to battle against Mayweather as a shorter, heavy footed, fairly slow, one-handed fighter is a recipe for a white washing.

DLH was taller, had a long quick jab, a lefthook that was one of the best in the business, good handspeed and a great chin / durability. Floyd had to respect to Oscar for the better part of the fight and find a way to tag him from outside range

Judah was a southpaw, which meant Floyd couldn't shoulder roll with him in there and had to fight him more squared up, who had lightning fast hands, and a ridiculous uppercut to go with a savage straight left.

I saw you mentioned Castillo, but that was a smaller Floyd against a bigger Castillo who was also a ton more durable than Cotto, I am not sure I agree that he was slower, plus he is one of our generations great pressure / inside fighters, Cotto is not.

Cotto isn't going to walk Floyd down and pressure him because he is too slow a foot, doesn't go to the body like he used to, and he cannot take the punishment required to do so. Cotto isn't going to counter Floyd because he will eat shot after shot without getting off anything substantive in return because his feet are too heavy.

All that said, just because my logic dictates that this fight is totally uncompetitive doesn't make it so...so I am going to suspend what I deem to be rational thought here for a second and accept that there is a possibility that I am missing something. So what am I missing Fitz? You are a long time fight fan and I respect your opinion, what am I not seeing? How does Cotto have a chance at beating Floyd or even making it a competitive fight in there?

Shorter? Yes

Heavy footed? Yes, he is slow on his feet, but moves well on his feet if that makes sense. Margarito's feet are slow as shit, and at one point, he was the most feared man for Mayweather. Castillo isn't that fleet footed either. Cotto is slow on his feet, but he is able to slide, pivot and turn well. Slow on his feet, but doesn't have bad footwork.

Fairly slow? Only on his feet, I would not consider him slow in the hand department. Is he quicker than Floyd? Absolutely not, but he matched Mosley for speed. Cotto's hand speed I think gets underrated, he just seems slow because of the way he moves, but I don't think he is fairly slow. He did slow down in handspeed inbetween the first Margarito fight until recently, but his last fight, he had some decent speed again.

One handed fighter? He was, but I saw promising signs and he was using his right hand beautifully in his last fight and added that to his arsenal.

I don't know, I think Castillo is slower than Cotto, in the hand department anyways. Neither are that quick on their feet.

You are right about Judah and DLH, they were very relevant reasons you put, but I still think Cotto's style will make Floyd wait a little bit more and I think he may give up some early rounds by Cotto being the more aggressive.
That said, Cotto switches to southpaw as well, and doesn't fight too bad from the southpaw stance. I think he could go through stages as well where he may switch.

I have always thought that the person to beat Mayweather (not saying Cotto is the one, but I really like how he matches up) will probably be someone that people don't expect. That's not my reasoning though, I'm just saying. On paper, it doesn't look like Cotto matches up well, but stylistically, I like it.

I like Cotto in this because I think he has a good mixture of pressure/boxing for Floyd. I think past opponents have been too much pressure, and Floyd loves that, he looks stronger because people are walking into his shots. Cotto applies pressure, but is not too forward.
Much like Cotto's losses, he has fought going backward as the other guy presses forward. Cotto doesn't have a huge tank and fighting backwards doesn't help.
I'm not 100% sure Mayweather walks Cotto down like Margarito and Pacquiao. Will Mayweather stay in front of him, and stand his ground like in the Mosley fight? Yes, I think he will. But I'm not sure if he will make Cotto go back and Mayweather pressing. I think he is more likely to stand his ground and use angles. I think Cotto may be fresher than in past fights because of this.
I just don't think we will see the offensive guy we saw with the Mosley/Hatton/Ortiz fight. I think we will get the more cautious version we saw with DLH/Baldomir/Marquez. Where guys aren't coming out all guns blazing, and Mayweather is opening up and countering with power as the guys move into his shots.
Cotto isn't as reckless and will let his hands go as much as the other guys, and I think Mayweather workrate drops out of this. I can see Cotto winning early rounds on aggression, and Mayweather will come on a bit later.
I think we get a similar structure to the Judah fight, where Mayweather will lose early rounds and come on later.

A couple thoughts...

This Cotto is nowhere near the guy that fought Mosley. He doesn't have the same reflexes, timing, speed, willingness to get hit or instinct...can we agree on that?

Cotto is a one-handed fighter, he has been his whole career, and random use of the right against a one-eyed Margarito does not a two-handed fighter make.

Re-watch Mayweather - Castillo, I don't think you will come back with the notion that JLC was slower than this version of Cotto.

Cotto switching to southpaw would be a disaster, Floyd would jump on him and light him up with lead rights.

Cotto isn't a pressure fighter digging that left hook downstairs anymore, that guy is gone.

The Judah fight looked the way it did because Zab had the faster hands for 6 rounds, fought out of a stance that forced Mayweather out of his comfort zone, and he fought the best 5 rounds of his life. Cotto will be afforded none of those advantages.

If Cotto sits back he will get torn up, if Cotto pressures he will get torn up.

I read everything you wrote there, but I am not coming away with any understanding how Cotto could do it. I honestly do not see one advantage Cotto would have going in, and that even includes things we often give to Floyd's opponents like chin or youth.

Sorry man, I am just not seeing any common ground with you here...but that's why they fight the fights.

[the ollie reed fan club]

STEVENSKI Wrote:That is a fair point Fitz. I would give Cotto no more than a 10% chance to beat mayweather but he would have a chance. I also think Cotto is probably the most deserving opponent bar Pac & Martinez.

Take away about 9.99% of that and you have the kind of chance i would give Cotto. But hey as JD says that's why they have the fights.

This is the kind of fight that if it took place I would bet the family farm on. I would cobble together every amount of available cash and lay it on Floyd.

Cotto is just good enough to ensure that Floyd doesn't sleep on him, no way he pulls the upset.

[STEVENSKI]

JD Wrote:I read everything you wrote there, but I am not coming away with any understanding how Cotto could do it. I honestly do not see one advantage Cotto would have going in, and that even includes things we often give to Floyd's opponents like chin or youth.

Sorry man, I am just not seeing any common ground with you here...but that's why they fight the fights.

JD is bang on here. Floyd is a great boxer & most of his opponents to date have had no chance when it comes to boxing with Floyd over 12 rounds. I am of the opinion that most fights he has the opponent knows they have somewhere between fuck all & no chance to beat Floyd.

That is why I believe that if Cotto fights Floyd he should go balls out & swing for the fences for 2 rounds & if he cannot get the KO quit on his stool. That would achieve two things. One his career will be over after facing Floyd & Cotto would not have to take a terrible beating like he has in his other losses & could have a nice fat retirement cheque to boot. Two the blame for Cotto quitting would fall squarely on Floyd for having selected him to fight.

[JONdaCON]

Come on guys... if fights happened the way we thought they did then why would we even watch?.... im sure everyone thought that Tyson vs Douglas was a waste of fight and im sure there are alot more examples... Cotto would be a tougher fight then almost anyone else out there... i guess only time will tell.

[Fitz]

JD Wrote:A couple thoughts...

This Cotto is nowhere near the guy that fought Mosley. He doesn't have the same reflexes, timing, speed, willingness to get hit or instinct...can we agree on that?

Cotto is a one-handed fighter, he has been his whole career, and random use of the right against a one-eyed Margarito does not a two-handed fighter make.

Re-watch Mayweather - Castillo, I don't think you will come back with the notion that JLC was slower than this version of Cotto.

Cotto switching to southpaw would be a disaster, Floyd would jump on him and light him up with lead rights.

Cotto isn't a pressure fighter digging that left hook downstairs anymore, that guy is gone.

The Judah fight looked the way it did because Zab had the faster hands for 6 rounds, fought out of a stance that forced Mayweather out of his comfort zone, and he fought the best 5 rounds of his life. Cotto will be afforded none of those advantages.

If Cotto sits back he will get torn up, if Cotto pressures he will get torn up.

I read everything you wrote there, but I am not coming away with any understanding how Cotto could do it. I honestly do not see one advantage Cotto would have going in, and that even includes things we often give to Floyd's opponents like chin or youth.

Sorry man, I am just not seeing any common ground with you here...but that's why they fight the fights.

Let's just agree to disagree.

About Castillo, I didn't think he got robbed anyways. I don't think either fighter did enough to take the fight clearly. Cotto looked slow against Jennings and Clottey and maybe another fight inbetween, but he had some speed back in his last fight (and no, it didn't have anything to do with Margarito being that slow, Cotto was punching better).

I'm just mentioning that Cotto had more than his left hand in his last fight, and was using his right more than usual. Cotto has made adjustment in time, he has jabbed more, boxed more, he now clinches.....why is it so unbelievable that I saw him add something else to his arsenal, when he has in so many other areas?

Cotto never clinched before his last fight, and used to run and had no idea how to hold. Cotto never clinched in his whole career, and all of a sudden learnt to do it in his last fight. Surely you don't think I should dismiss this aspect of Cotto because he only did it once at random times in his last fight?

I have seen Cotto learn and add new things to his game plan like using the jab more, knowing when and how to clinch etc. I have seen him make these adjustments, and I saw his also use the right hand in his last fight. I'm not saying that his right hand is lethal, or that is what's going to make the fight close, but I did see it in his last fight.
I'm just not going to dismiss it because he used it once, he used the clinch in one fight as well.

Cotto isn't physically the same as he once was, but I think he is in a better place mentally, made changes etc. Some guys aren't the same physically, but can be just as successful with change.
Look at George Foreman, he was not the same physically, but many think the older George Foreman was better, and smarter. I have seen positive signs in Cotto, even if I don't think he is the same guy physically.

[Fitz]

There really isn't a guy that can beat Mayweather clearly, even now I would probably pick Mayweather over Cotto, I just don't agree with how people are talking about Cotto in that match up.

I swear, out of every single bum and trash fight that Mayweather has been in, and it really seems like Cotto is being disrespected the most out of everyone, and that is including Baldomir, Mitchell, Marquez, Hatton etc, lol.

If nobody knew who Cotto was, someone would come in here and think we are talking about a journeyman.