Saul "Canelo" Alvarez vs. Shane Mosley

[Fitz]

the ollie reed fan club Wrote:

Fitz Wrote:Agreed. I thought Alvarez won clearly but he got hit too much, Mosley was in this fight despite losing and not all of his shots were just pitter patter stuff. I remember some stuff he threw, he had nothing on them, but he did throw some shots with a bit more behind them as well.
Alvarez got hit too much and he should have had a much easier time with Mosley IMO. I didn't watch the fight and think Alvarez was on cruise control or absolutely dominating or anything. It was a close and competitive fight that Alvarez won clearly. I think Alvarez should have dominated Mosley more.

Man I think you are being too hard on Alvarez.

The kind is still only 21 and has no amateur experience and is learning on the job. Tell me which other 21 year old pro fighter do you think is doing a better job right now?

I know it's hard because you have to cut out all the bullshit in between, the silly trinket belt, the ridiculous paychecks, the hype and the Golden Boy hoo-ha, but underneath all that is a genuinely decent prospect and one of the more exciting younger fighters around.

Since 2010 he has fought the likes of Cotto's brother, Rhodes, Hatton the younger and has progressed slightly up with fights against Gomez, Cintron and now Mosley. That I think is probably a pretty good progression for a fighter to make. And the Mosley fight I think was even better for him because Mosley came to fight and he had to learn to show some patience and deal with the cut. I think his camp can be relatively pleased with the outcome.

He is still far far far from the finished level, but what else would you expect from a 21 year old?

I thought he would knock out Mosley too, but man Mosley came proud in this fight. And no-one has ever been able to KO Shane before so no big deal if Alvarez can't do it either.

Alvarez has a lot to learn and some of the faults listed in this thread are bang on the money, but I'll come back to my original point which is that there aren't too many other 21 year olds doing what he is doing right now. For me the most pleasing thing is that he is making improvements each time he fights.

The Alvarez of 2012 is already a lot better than the version that was in serious trouble against Jose Cotto in 2010.

No I'm not ready to anoint him as the new savior of boxing, but I am pleased with his growth and look forward to watching him fight in the future. I so hope they throw Kirkland in against him, I think he eats up Kirkland for lunch. Fuck me that fight has 'fan friendly' written all over it.

Haha. Sorry, I'm only laughing because I used to say exactly what you are saying about him being 21 still, with no amateur background. I said the same thing to defend Chavez years ago.

But you are right, I am not looking at him as a 21 year old with no amateur experience. Now that I think about it, I am being harsh based on that.
I know it isn't hit fault, he doesn't decide how he comes up. But once he holds a major world title, it's harder to let things slide and look at him as a kid.
This was a world title defence for Alvarez, and Mosley gained this title shot coming off the Pacquiao performance. This was a garbage fight to begin with, and the type of fight Alvarez should have been taking leading up to a world title, not defending. Mosley was never put into this fight to be any type of 'challenge' for him. It was on the undercard for Canelo to look spectacular in and stop Mosley in. I don't know what else they would have expected from Mosley based on the Pacquiao performance. I'm sure the intentions and expectations was Alvarez to stop Shane Mosley for the first time on this undercard.

But to answer your question. Looking at him holding no world title. He is coming along very nicely and has fought excellent opposition for his age. I don't know anyone around his age that is doing better.
Not his fault, but I can't help but raise the benchmark based on him being a world champion and marketed as one as well. A bit of a responsibility comes with that IMO.

I still think the fight was more competitive than it was supposed to, and not to say Mosley didn't receive his beating. But Mosley was in the fight for the whole 12 rounds, even though he wasn't winning it or looking like winning. Just a little too competitive for me. Exciting fight though and I did enjoy it.

[SmartyBeardo]

Fitz Wrote:

the ollie reed fan club Wrote:

Fitz Wrote:Agreed. I thought Alvarez won clearly but he got hit too much, Mosley was in this fight despite losing and not all of his shots were just pitter patter stuff. I remember some stuff he threw, he had nothing on them, but he did throw some shots with a bit more behind them as well.
Alvarez got hit too much and he should have had a much easier time with Mosley IMO. I didn't watch the fight and think Alvarez was on cruise control or absolutely dominating or anything. It was a close and competitive fight that Alvarez won clearly. I think Alvarez should have dominated Mosley more.

Man I think you are being too hard on Alvarez.

The kind is still only 21 and has no amateur experience and is learning on the job. Tell me which other 21 year old pro fighter do you think is doing a better job right now?

I know it's hard because you have to cut out all the bullshit in between, the silly trinket belt, the ridiculous paychecks, the hype and the Golden Boy hoo-ha, but underneath all that is a genuinely decent prospect and one of the more exciting younger fighters around.

Since 2010 he has fought the likes of Cotto's brother, Rhodes, Hatton the younger and has progressed slightly up with fights against Gomez, Cintron and now Mosley. That I think is probably a pretty good progression for a fighter to make. And the Mosley fight I think was even better for him because Mosley came to fight and he had to learn to show some patience and deal with the cut. I think his camp can be relatively pleased with the outcome.

He is still far far far from the finished level, but what else would you expect from a 21 year old?

I thought he would knock out Mosley too, but man Mosley came proud in this fight. And no-one has ever been able to KO Shane before so no big deal if Alvarez can't do it either.

Alvarez has a lot to learn and some of the faults listed in this thread are bang on the money, but I'll come back to my original point which is that there aren't too many other 21 year olds doing what he is doing right now. For me the most pleasing thing is that he is making improvements each time he fights.

The Alvarez of 2012 is already a lot better than the version that was in serious trouble against Jose Cotto in 2010.

No I'm not ready to anoint him as the new savior of boxing, but I am pleased with his growth and look forward to watching him fight in the future. I so hope they throw Kirkland in against him, I think he eats up Kirkland for lunch. Fuck me that fight has 'fan friendly' written all over it.

Haha. Sorry, I'm only laughing because I used to say exactly what you are saying about him being 21 still, with no amateur background. I said the same thing to defend Chavez years ago.

But you are right, I am not looking at him as a 21 year old with no amateur experience. Now that I think about it, I am being harsh based on that.
I know it isn't hit fault, he doesn't decide how he comes up. But once he holds a major world title, it's harder to let things slide and look at him as a kid.
This was a world title defence for Alvarez, and Mosley gained this title shot coming off the Pacquiao performance. This was a garbage fight to begin with, and the type of fight Alvarez should have been taking leading up to a world title, not defending. Mosley was never put into this fight to be any type of 'challenge' for him. It was on the undercard for Canelo to look spectacular in and stop Mosley in. I don't know what else they would have expected from Mosley based on the Pacquiao performance. I'm sure the intentions and expectations was Alvarez to stop Shane Mosley for the first time on this undercard.

But to answer your question. Looking at him holding no world title. He is coming along very nicely and has fought excellent opposition for his age. I don't know anyone around his age that is doing better.
Not his fault, but I can't help but raise the benchmark based on him being a world champion and marketed as one as well. A bit of a responsibility comes with that IMO.

I still think the fight was more competitive than it was supposed to, and not to say Mosley didn't receive his beating. But Mosley was in the fight for the whole 12 rounds, even though he wasn't winning it or looking like winning. Just a little too competitive for me. Exciting fight though and I did enjoy it.

I've given SSM a bunch of credit for his performance but RedOnTheHead got hit entirely too much by an old dude who was literally winding up to throw his heavy right hand. He either couldn't get out of the way or he couldn't be bothered. Neither of those options bode well for the kid in the future.

He does not have good head movement/feints. He is not busy enough at his age. He could have had SSM out of there late if he would have worked a bit harder to the body and comboed up the ladder. SSM would have had to retire on his stool somewhere around 10.

RedOnTheHead stands motionless, waiting too much. It is true that he is young and he is improving and he will be gifted decisions that his inactivity leaves in question, but due to his size he will be heading north before long where allowing professionals to land telegraphed punches will lead you to twitch.

This is a perfect example of why the proliferation of sanctioning fucks is anything but good for boxing. RedOnTheHead is developing decently. No way in hell should he be defending a world championship. It devalues the sport and his accomplishments.

It is a bad joke.

[kidbazooka1]

Kirland would be a nice win for Canelo.

[Dickagon]

Canelo has gotten better since he first started working with gbp but this isn't some just some 21 year old looking to develop and work his way to a title shot. he got handed a title, he wanted his own venue for when he's on the undercard for Mayweather v Ortiz, he got 2 mil to fight Mosley on an undercard fight and he's doing his 1st ppv about 4 months from now. when he starts doing ppvs is GBP going to risk start making him fight tough opposition and risk him losing? too much on the line for that. Canelo aint bad on his own but what is happening with him is a joke.

[SmartyBeardo]

gravytrain Wrote:Canelo has gotten better since he first started working with gbp but this isn't some just some 21 year old looking to develop and work his way to a title shot. he got handed a title, he wanted his own venue for when he's on the undercard for Mayweather v Ortiz, he got 2 mil to fight Mosley on an undercard fight and he's doing his 1st ppv about 4 months from now. when he starts doing ppvs is GBP going to risk start making him fight tough opposition and risk him losing? too much on the line for that. Canelo aint bad on his own but what is happening with him is a joke.

How could you speak of Prince RedOnTheHead that way?

[JONdaCON]

SmartyBeardo Wrote:

gravytrain Wrote:Canelo has gotten better since he first started working with gbp but this isn't some just some 21 year old looking to develop and work his way to a title shot. he got handed a title, he wanted his own venue for when he's on the undercard for Mayweather v Ortiz, he got 2 mil to fight Mosley on an undercard fight and he's doing his 1st ppv about 4 months from now. when he starts doing ppvs is GBP going to risk start making him fight tough opposition and risk him losing? too much on the line for that. Canelo aint bad on his own but what is happening with him is a joke.

How could you speak of Prince RedOnTheHead that way?

Lmao.

He's still a princess.

[SmartyBeardo]

JONdaCON Wrote:

SmartyBeardo Wrote:

gravytrain Wrote:Canelo has gotten better since he first started working with gbp but this isn't some just some 21 year old looking to develop and work his way to a title shot. he got handed a title, he wanted his own venue for when he's on the undercard for Mayweather v Ortiz, he got 2 mil to fight Mosley on an undercard fight and he's doing his 1st ppv about 4 months from now. when he starts doing ppvs is GBP going to risk start making him fight tough opposition and risk him losing? too much on the line for that. Canelo aint bad on his own but what is happening with him is a joke.

How could you speak of Prince RedOnTheHead that way?

Lmao.

He's still a princess.

Dammit! another typo.

[Dickagon]

SmartyBeardo Wrote:

gravytrain Wrote:Canelo has gotten better since he first started working with gbp but this isn't some just some 21 year old looking to develop and work his way to a title shot. he got handed a title, he wanted his own venue for when he's on the undercard for Mayweather v Ortiz, he got 2 mil to fight Mosley on an undercard fight and he's doing his 1st ppv about 4 months from now. when he starts doing ppvs is GBP going to risk start making him fight tough opposition and risk him losing? too much on the line for that. Canelo aint bad on his own but what is happening with him is a joke.

How could you speak of Prince RedOnTheHead that way?

being a hater far beyond my years. kind of like this cat but i don't look like uncle Phil from Fresh Prince http://www.commercialappeal.com/news/201...saggy-pan/