WBA's new scoring system

[blackbelt2003]

ViperSniper Wrote:

Fitz Wrote:

ViperSniper Wrote:The new WBA scoring system would not make it harder for any kind of boxer to win fights than the current one thats already used. It would just make margins closer & possibly prevent boxers from coasting.

I'm all for even 10-10 rounds & having championship fights have an odd amount of rounds weather that be 13 or 15 rounds.

Yes it would. blackbelt has already shown why. Maybe not for every fight, but it does leave that scenario for a certain fighter.

By the same token a brawler, pressure fighter, high work rate fighter would still have the same oppotunity they do now to steal rounds (big or small) than the new WBA scoring system. 'boxers' would not be in any more favor in the new system. There will still be judges around who still look for aggression, high work rate, heavier or cleaner shots.

Only time is when it may favor a 'boxer' (..or any superior opponent) is if they are coasting & find themselves in a situation where they all of a sudden need to put thier foot down on the pedal. But that comes back to why this scoring system may work (which also comes down to good judging). It will not make the margins of the final scorecards wider, but closer & may prevent fighters from coasting.

But generally, when a pure boxer wins a round, they win it in dominant fashion.



When a slugger wins a round, they almost take as many shots as they give and win it on heart and power.



Therefore, all the dominant rounds would go in the boxer's favour. For a slugger to have a dominant round he'd have to be teeing off on the guy.



Say goodbye to all your Jake LaMottas, Arturo Gattis, Carl Frochs and the other guys who keep the fight game alive. They'd be losing plenty of decisions they'd be winning with today's scoring.





Black

[JD]

Sweet...lets give incompetent idiots more variables to fuck up!

[BrutalBodyShots]

blackbelt2003 Wrote:

ViperSniper Wrote:

Fitz Wrote:

ViperSniper Wrote:The new WBA scoring system would not make it harder for any kind of boxer to win fights than the current one thats already used. It would just make margins closer & possibly prevent boxers from coasting.

I'm all for even 10-10 rounds & having championship fights have an odd amount of rounds weather that be 13 or 15 rounds.

Yes it would. blackbelt has already shown why. Maybe not for every fight, but it does leave that scenario for a certain fighter.

By the same token a brawler, pressure fighter, high work rate fighter would still have the same oppotunity they do now to steal rounds (big or small) than the new WBA scoring system. 'boxers' would not be in any more favor in the new system. There will still be judges around who still look for aggression, high work rate, heavier or cleaner shots.

Only time is when it may favor a 'boxer' (..or any superior opponent) is if they are coasting & find themselves in a situation where they all of a sudden need to put thier foot down on the pedal. But that comes back to why this scoring system may work (which also comes down to good judging). It will not make the margins of the final scorecards wider, but closer & may prevent fighters from coasting.

But generally, when a pure boxer wins a round, they win it in dominant fashion.



When a slugger wins a round, they almost take as many shots as they give and win it on heart and power.



Therefore, all the dominant rounds would go in the boxer's favour. For a slugger to have a dominant round he'd have to be teeing off on the guy.



Say goodbye to all your Jake LaMottas, Arturo Gattis, Carl Frochs and the other guys who keep the fight game alive. They'd be losing plenty of decisions they'd be winning with today's scoring.





Black

Black, I don't get your rationale.

If a brawler is going to lose more rounds than he wins in a fight, he's going to lose. It doesn't matter if he loses 7 rounds 10-9, loses 7 rounds 10-8 or loses 7 rounds 10-1. Regardless he's going to lose.

That said, if he's going to KO his opponent within 12 rounds, the score isn't relevant as score cards go out the window in the event of a KO.

Therefore in the case of the brawler, what does a different scoring system matter?

[BrutalBodyShots]

ViperSniper Wrote:

Fitz Wrote:

ViperSniper Wrote:The new WBA scoring system would not make it harder for any kind of boxer to win fights than the current one thats already used. It would just make margins closer & possibly prevent boxers from coasting.

I'm all for even 10-10 rounds & having championship fights have an odd amount of rounds weather that be 13 or 15 rounds.

Yes it would. blackbelt has already shown why. Maybe not for every fight, but it does leave that scenario for a certain fighter.

By the same token a brawler, pressure fighter, high work rate fighter would still have the same oppotunity they do now to steal rounds (big or small) than the new WBA scoring system. 'boxers' would not be in any more favor in the new system. There will still be judges around who still look for aggression, high work rate, heavier or cleaner shots.

Only time is when it may favor a 'boxer' (..or any superior opponent) is if they are coasting & find themselves in a situation where they all of a sudden need to put thier foot down on the pedal. But that comes back to why this scoring system may work (which also comes down to good judging). It will not make the margins of the final scorecards wider, but closer & may prevent fighters from coasting.

Viper is correct. They style a fighter fights in wouldn't matter with respect to scoring system criteria.

The criteria is the same. If you would score the round for a brawler in the current system you would score it for him in a revised system. If you'd score it for the boxer in the current system, you'd score it for the boxer in the revised system. The same guys would win the same rounds. No one is suggesting that the criteria judges use to score rounds on should be reformed... at least not near as I can tell in this thread.

[ViperSniper]

BrutalBodyShots Wrote:

ViperSniper Wrote:

Fitz Wrote:

ViperSniper Wrote:The new WBA scoring system would not make it harder for any kind of boxer to win fights than the current one thats already used. It would just make margins closer & possibly prevent boxers from coasting.

I'm all for even 10-10 rounds & having championship fights have an odd amount of rounds weather that be 13 or 15 rounds.

Yes it would. blackbelt has already shown why. Maybe not for every fight, but it does leave that scenario for a certain fighter.

By the same token a brawler, pressure fighter, high work rate fighter would still have the same oppotunity they do now to steal rounds (big or small) than the new WBA scoring system. 'boxers' would not be in any more favor in the new system. There will still be judges around who still look for aggression, high work rate, heavier or cleaner shots.

Only time is when it may favor a 'boxer' (..or any superior opponent) is if they are coasting & find themselves in a situation where they all of a sudden need to put thier foot down on the pedal. But that comes back to why this scoring system may work (which also comes down to good judging). It will not make the margins of the final scorecards wider, but closer & may prevent fighters from coasting.

Viper is correct. They style a fighter fights in wouldn't matter with respect to scoring system criteria.

The criteria is the same. If you would score the round for a brawler in the current system you would score it for him in a revised system. If you'd score it for the boxer in the current system, you'd score it for the boxer in the revised system. The same guys would win the same rounds. No one is suggesting that the criteria judges use to score rounds on should be reformed... at least not near as I can tell in this thread.

Exactly. The scoring criteria would not change, only the scorin system. 'Boxers' don't always win rounds big..nothing stopping a brawler from wining rounds big with the current or new system. Look at a fighter like bam bam Rios. He is a good example of winning alot of rounds big & clear rounds. Cloud. Mathysse.

Aggresive fighters only chances are not to squeeze out rounds or by a come from behind KO.

I don't think the current system is soo bad, I just don't beleive the new one would make scores wider or favour a style!

[BrutalBodyShots]

Yup I see it the same way. Boxers don't win their rounds any bigger than brawlers do as a whole. In fact, I think an argument could be made to the opposite - that brawlers are able to make their rounds more visible to judges eyes because they are the ones doing more damage and hurting their opponents when they land.

[Fitz]

If it isn't going to change the scoring like you guys say it is, and under the new system a boxer would win the round, the same as the old system. Just like a brawler would win the round in both scoring systems, and it doesn't matter if he loses the 7 rounds by what ever margin, as he still loses the fight.
What is the whole freaking point of changing the scoring if it doesn't make a difference?

So the logic behind the new scoring system is to not get 'correct' results, it's just to make scorecards more 'reflective' of the fight, though with the same outcome.
Well then that is such a stupid notion, if the conclusion is that NOTHING is going to change on a scorecard, and just give more windows of opportunities for a judge to get a card even more incorrect.

So the scoring system is changing so we can have a more reflective card. Instead of having a 118-110 card (which was competitive), we can now have a new scoring system that gives it a possibility of a 118-113 instead, which can give a more accurate 'reflection' on how easy/difficult a fighter won.
Seems pretty stupid to me, when the issue isn't the 'scoring' and it's the judges. Change a scoring system that allows the possibility for worse cards, so we can have a better reflection on the competitiveness of the fight.

[BrutalBodyShots]

No no Fitz. Here's an example.

Current system fighter A squeaks out the first 6 rounds, fighter B dominates/clearly wins the final 6. Current system score card? 114-114.

With the proposed system you'd end up with cards that read something like 114-111 & 113-112. Cards that more reflect what just happened - that is one guy doing more damage than the other and the result now being that the fight has a winner rather than a draw.

[Byrd Man]

Why not go to odd number rounds. No more draws (or at least a lot less of them) and perhaps that might affect some of the bad decisions as well. Dunno, just spitballing here.

[BrutalBodyShots]

Byrd Man Wrote:Why not go to odd number rounds. No more draws (or at least a lot less of them) and perhaps that might affect some of the bad decisions as well. Dunno, just spitballing here.

I think that's an option and I agree that it would eliminate draws to some degree.

However, I feel that the problem is that most draws aren't in fact REALLY draws. I know I keep saying the same thing over and over again but an extremely close round that could go either way shouldn't be scored the same as a round that is clear as day who inflicted more clean, effective punches. So long as we keep scoring rounds the same to a guy that wins it with one jab then the next to the other guy that wins it with 20 crumpling body shots we're going to arrive at scores that don't reflect what went on in the ring.