Mosley or Toney - who had the best career?

[blackbelt2003]

I've never seen a fighter go from one version of himself for half a career to another version of himself for the remainder like Mosley.

That Forrest fight changed everything about Mosley. He literally went from combination puncher with vicious intent to a one shot/one trick pony overnight.



Black

[Dickagon]

Mosley went from the best version of himself to the worst. I wouldn't say he transformed.

[Spyder]

(02-15-2017 09:28 AM)JD Wrote:  Mosley was junk after Forrest

I would say that he had flashes of brilliance, but couldn't put them together in a complete effort. His fight against Margarito was probably the closest that he got after Forrest.

[ViperSniper]

For me Mosley looked less fluid when he made his move to Welterweight but still really good. After Forrest though, his soul & confidence was taken. Then when he moved up again and got owned by Winky, he was stuck in a shitty style and remained in it for the rest of his career. It was against Winky though where Mosley developed the habbit of over loading on each shot. That Winky D had him worked up and frustrated.

You can see a big difference though from before and after his fights with Vernon Forrest. Mosley's problem was, he still believed he was the same fighter and never bothered to switch his game as he moved up. Mosley thought he was still able to move like a lightweight when in reality he was a guy fighting 2-3 divisions heavier against bigger guys who were at the top of their division. Someone forgot to tell Mosley he was no longer the same fighter, so he continued with a bad approach.

[Dickagon]

Mosley was a ww champion, ranked as p4p one of the best fighters and a favorite going into the Forrest fight.

Look at Mosley vs Molina, you can see glimpses of Shitty Shane in the ring. He wasn't all Sugar down at 135. He just had a nice height, reach, speed and power advantage down at 135.

[ViperSniper]

(02-16-2017 02:41 AM)Dickagon Wrote:  Look at Mosley vs Molina, you can see glimpses of Shitty Shane in the ring. He wasn't all Sugar down at 135. He just had a nice height, reach, speed and power advantage down at 135.

Which fight do you think Shane was at his best Dickagon?
When was Toney at his best? Because regardless of what division he fought in..Toney was known for looking shitty throughout his career, against far lesser opponents too.

[blackbelt2003]

A lot of people thought Dave Tiberi deserved the decision vs prime middleweight Toney.



Black

[and the NEW]

(02-15-2017 08:27 AM)the ollie reed fan club Wrote:  Your comment was so if your not referencing Floyd's shoulder defence then what/who were you referring to? Because I'm damn sure Shane NEVER faced anyone with a shoulder D as good as James'.

My point is that in a round or two, a shot Mosley managed to land and rock Floyd on two occassions. I wouldn't call that having trouble with the shoulder D.

Toney never beat nobody near the level of a boxer mover as Mosley. Nunn wasn't on the level. Montell Griffen took him easily (lllloooooooolllllll). Roy made him look foolish. Toney was built for the pros, but guys who could box and move at an elite level (Montell wasn't even an elite fighter like Shane) made him look fat and lazy.

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(02-16-2017 02:41 AM)Dickagon Wrote:  Mosley was a ww champion, ranked as p4p one of the best fighters and a favorite going into the Forrest fight.

Look at Mosley vs Molina, you can see glimpses of Shitty Shane in the ring. He wasn't all Sugar down at 135. He just had a nice height, reach, speed and power advantage down at 135.

But Mosley still beat the ass of Molina, who was a very very good fighter, he was in like 15 or so world title fights. Toney in his prime, couldn't even catch Montel Griffin! LOL. Griffin was on the John John Molina level (if he is lucky) and Toney LOST to him.........TWICE!! What a fukcing fat lazy chunt!

[the ollie reed fan club]

(02-16-2017 04:27 AM)and the NEW Wrote:  My point is that in a round or two, a shot Mosley managed to land and rock Floyd on two occassions. I wouldn't call that having trouble with the shoulder D.

Toney never beat nobody near the level of a boxer mover as Mosley. Nunn wasn't on the level. Montell Griffen took him easily (lllloooooooolllllll). Roy made him look foolish. Toney was built for the pros, but guys who could box and move at an elite level (Montell wasn't even an elite fighter like Shane) made him look fat and lazy.

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But Mosley still beat the ass of Molina, who was a very very good fighter, he was in like 15 or so world title fights. Toney in his prime, couldn't even catch Montel Griffin! LOL. Griffin was on the John John Molina level (if he is lucky) and Toney LOST to him.........TWICE!! What a fukcing fat lazy chunt!

You've contradicted yourself. On one hand you say Shane handled Floyd's shoulder defence well but then on the other hand you went into a detailed analysis of how Floyd used his shoulder defence completely differently to Toney. So (since YOU raised it) if Toney's shoulder D is completely different to Floyd's (as outlined in your own analysis) then how do you know he would've done well against Toney's?

[ViperSniper]

(02-16-2017 06:47 AM)the ollie reed fan club Wrote:  You've contradicted yourself. On one hand you say Shane handled Floyd's shoulder defence well but then on the other hand you went into a detailed analysis of how Floyd used his shoulder defence completely differently to Toney. So (since YOU raised it) if Toney's shoulder D is completely different to Floyd's (as outlined in your own analysis) then how do you know he would've done well against Toney's?

ATN pretty much went over all of this with you already, just a page ago...post: #158 of this thread..

(02-15-2017 02:59 AM)and the NEW Wrote:  That's because Mosley was shot and could barely get off at that point unless somebody stood infront of him like Margarito, who had zero concept of lateral movement, yet he still managed to rock Floyd. The overhand right troubles Floyd's shoulder roll, simple as that. Mosley threw a wicked, fast overhand right. But either way, Floyd' use of the shoulder is nothing like Toney's. Floyd closes up behind the lead shoulder and cuts off the angle by standing tall (which is why the overhand right works well on him). Toney rolls his entire body with shots (the way that Eddie Futch and Gil Clancy used to teach), it is a completely different use of the shoulder. I actually don't think Mosley's overhand right would do well against Toney's D. But the jab, speed, combination punching and movement is what gives Toney fits, and that was Mosley's bread and butter prior to being ruined by Forrest (if you want to use the version of Mosley that fought Mayweather, then we better start using the version of Toney that lost to Drake Thadzi).