Calling out fighters you thought got a pass

[BrotherCane]

Snoop Wrote:

Maxy Wrote:How self conceited and obnoxious is it to claim that Americans don't have to travel cos they are the best and American is the Mecca? So you admit American fighters are always at an advantage cos they box in their own territory? Bit of an uneven playing field, don't ya reckon? Especially as they are already so much better?

Lennox Lewis boxed in America in his 2nd fight? So fuckin' what. Chris Eubank had his first 5 bouts in America.

Be nice to see Ward travel to Canada to box Bute if Bute beats Froch. Will that happen? Don't even think about it. Of course though, America is the mecca and Ward has a divine right to stay a homer his entire career....and be given a pass for it too.

It's not meant to be conceited and obnoxious at all, it's just how the industry of boxing is structured. You tell me which country generates the most revenue for boxing and that is where the best fights and fighters are going to be because at the end of the day, boxing, like most things in the world, is driven by money. It's not even to say that American boxers are better, just that there's more money running through boxing in America. That's all.

I also think people are forgetting how little choice a fighter actually has in deciding who and where they want to fight. Most of it is negotiated with lawyers, promoters, managers, sanctioning bodies, cable TV networks, etc., which is why you often hear fighters saying, "I'll fight whoever my promoter wants me to fight." Of course there are exceptions of fighters that do have some autonomy in dictating their opponents and fight locations (Mayweather, DLH, Tyson), but for the most part, fighters don't have much say in where they fight.

Is it fair that Americans don't have to travel to prove themselves? No. But Americans don't have to travel for the same reasons British boxers, or any other boxers from another country has to travel to the US for a fight. In other words, an American boxier unwilling to leave home is criticized for being scared to lose homecourt advantage, NOT for avoiding top competition like a British boxer would be criticized for because most elite fighters (from ANY country) seek out fights in the US because, again, that's where the most money can be made from being a professional boxer.

Very well said Nick! Bravo man!

[KingEugene]

All fighters post Hopkins gets a pass because everybody always says Hopkins ruined them but in actuality they sucked to begin with.

Example...Pavlik.

[STEVENSKI]

KingEugene Wrote:All fighters post Hopkins gets a pass because everybody always says Hopkins ruined them but in actuality they sucked to begin with.

Example...Pavlik.

Don't forget RJJ & his daddy Tarver

[Gandalf The Black]

blackbelt2003 Wrote:

Gandalf The Black Wrote:I did look it up. Lewis' SECOND fight was in the U.S. Hatton had almost 30 fights before leaving the UK. He almost lost(did in my opinion) to Collazo in his American debut!!! He then manage to get dropped by Floyd and Pac. He rarely travelled outside the UK because he wasn't a very good fighter and was protected. You have an advantage over your opponent when they fight in your territory.

Just thought you might like to know that Hatton's 2nd fight was at Madison Square Garden, too. I'm pretty sure he fought in Atlantic City early on, and Germany, too.

And then I KNOW he fought a 12 rounder in the US, Detroit if I remember rightly, on a Showbox event, coming through a bad cut to take a Latin guy out in the 2nd.


That's just off the top of my head, so I don't know where you get 30 fights from?




Black

Ok. Great. If you want to give Hatton props for fighting a few time off his home turf in the earlier and latter part of his career...cool. If you want to give Hatton props for beating a 36 year old Kostya Tszyu...cool. If you want to give him props for fighting nobodies for a majority of his career except the last portion where he got pummeled by Collazo, Floyd and Pacquaio that's fine also.
http://www.youtube.com/v/sdvdFYVmjgM

[ROLLDEEP]

Gandalf The Black Wrote:

blackbelt2003 Wrote:

Gandalf The Black Wrote:I did look it up. Lewis' SECOND fight was in the U.S. Hatton had almost 30 fights before leaving the UK. He almost lost(did in my opinion) to Collazo in his American debut!!! He then manage to get dropped by Floyd and Pac. He rarely travelled outside the UK because he wasn't a very good fighter and was protected. You have an advantage over your opponent when they fight in your territory.

Just thought you might like to know that Hatton's 2nd fight was at Madison Square Garden, too. I'm pretty sure he fought in Atlantic City early on, and Germany, too.

And then I KNOW he fought a 12 rounder in the US, Detroit if I remember rightly, on a Showbox event, coming through a bad cut to take a Latin guy out in the 2nd.


That's just off the top of my head, so I don't know where you get 30 fights from?




Black

Ok. Great. If you want to give Hatton props for fighting a few time off his home turf in the earlier and latter part of his career...cool. If you want to give Hatton props for beating a 36 year old Kostya Tszyu...cool. If you want to give him props for fighting nobodies for a majority of his career except the last portion where he got pummeled by Collazo, Floyd and Pacquaio that's fine also.
http://www.youtube.com/v/sdvdFYVmjgM

Youre missing the point....it doesn't matter if he won, lost, got ko'ed in 5 seconds or whatever. We're not defending Hattons skills as he was a limited fighter who done the very best with his limited skill set.



We are however, challenging the notion he was protected and never fought anyone.


Snoop mentioned that boxers have to fight in America as thats where the money and names are.



Well guess what? For his weight, Hatton was probably most popular fighter at the time. So what did you want Hatton to do? Not build a fan base over here in the UK? Not polish his skills? Fly straight over to America, leave his British fans and turn his back on his country?


He had quite a balanced career I thought. A steady building up of a career and a fan base to which he travelled and tested his skills towards the end against the best. What else could he have done?

Again, I'm not bothered how he got on.....that a different topic and one we probably would all agree on. A B level fighter who failed to mix it with the best.


But fighting Tszyu, Floyd and Pac....the latter two away from home....and then saying he was protected? :surprise: What the...?

[Fitz]

Hatton has fought two p4p #1 fighters in his career and a #3 p4p fighter.

Most of the times, fighters don't have the chance to always fight the #1 fighter in the world. Hatton did this twice, and not many fighters can say they have done it before, period.
How many p4p #1 fighters has Floyd Mayweather fought in his career? How many has Pacquiao fought? How many p4p #1 fighters did Jones Jr fight? How many has Hopkins fought? How many did Tszyu fight? What about Morales? Trinidad?

I'd say most of them are at about the zero mark. Hatton did it on 2 occasions and against 2 different fighters, and then a top 3 p4p fighter. That's just to put things into perspective.

[lloyd mayflower]

ROLLDEEP Wrote:

Gandalf The Black Wrote:

blackbelt2003 Wrote:

Gandalf The Black Wrote:I did look it up. Lewis' SECOND fight was in the U.S. Hatton had almost 30 fights before leaving the UK. He almost lost(did in my opinion) to Collazo in his American debut!!! He then manage to get dropped by Floyd and Pac. He rarely travelled outside the UK because he wasn't a very good fighter and was protected. You have an advantage over your opponent when they fight in your territory.

Just thought you might like to know that Hatton's 2nd fight was at Madison Square Garden, too. I'm pretty sure he fought in Atlantic City early on, and Germany, too.

And then I KNOW he fought a 12 rounder in the US, Detroit if I remember rightly, on a Showbox event, coming through a bad cut to take a Latin guy out in the 2nd.


That's just off the top of my head, so I don't know where you get 30 fights from?




Black

Ok. Great. If you want to give Hatton props for fighting a few time off his home turf in the earlier and latter part of his career...cool. If you want to give Hatton props for beating a 36 year old Kostya Tszyu...cool. If you want to give him props for fighting nobodies for a majority of his career except the last portion where he got pummeled by Collazo, Floyd and Pacquaio that's fine also.
http://www.youtube.com/v/sdvdFYVmjgM

Youre missing the point....it doesn't matter if he won, lost, got ko'ed in 5 seconds or whatever. We're not defending Hattons skills as he was a limited fighter who done the very best with his limited skill set.



We are however, challenging the notion he was protected and never fought anyone.


Snoop mentioned that boxers have to fight in America as thats where the money and names are.



Well guess what? For his weight, Hatton was probably most popular fighter at the time. So what did you want Hatton to do? Not build a fan base over here in the UK? Not polish his skills? Fly straight over to America, leave his British fans and turn his back on his country?


He had quite a balanced career I thought. A steady building up of a career and a fan base to which he travelled and tested his skills towards the end against the best. What else could he have done?

Again, I'm not bothered how he got on.....that a different topic and one we probably would all agree on. A B level fighter who failed to mix it with the best.


But fighting Tszyu, Floyd and Pac....the latter two away from home....and then saying he was protected? :surprise: What the...?

Good post. The bottom line is with his fan base and PPV revenue, Hatton WAS the money and the power at 140. And he STILL left to take on challenges in America. He could have stayed in the MEN arena and still got massive fights for massive money, but he didn't. I honestly don't know what more Gandalf thinks he could have done to not warrant a place in this thread and i'm now leaning towards thinking hes just trolling.

140 lb fighter travels to Vegas to take on the 147 lb champ and recognised p4p number one. Protected?????

[blackbelt2003]

Gandalf The Black Wrote:

blackbelt2003 Wrote:

Gandalf The Black Wrote:I did look it up. Lewis' SECOND fight was in the U.S. Hatton had almost 30 fights before leaving the UK. He almost lost(did in my opinion) to Collazo in his American debut!!! He then manage to get dropped by Floyd and Pac. He rarely travelled outside the UK because he wasn't a very good fighter and was protected. You have an advantage over your opponent when they fight in your territory.

Just thought you might like to know that Hatton's 2nd fight was at Madison Square Garden, too. I'm pretty sure he fought in Atlantic City early on, and Germany, too.

And then I KNOW he fought a 12 rounder in the US, Detroit if I remember rightly, on a Showbox event, coming through a bad cut to take a Latin guy out in the 2nd.


That's just off the top of my head, so I don't know where you get 30 fights from?




Black

Ok. Great. If you want to give Hatton props for fighting a few time off his home turf in the earlier and latter part of his career...cool. If you want to give Hatton props for beating a 36 year old Kostya Tszyu...cool. If you want to give him props for fighting nobodies for a majority of his career except the last portion where he got pummeled by Collazo, Floyd and Pacquaio that's fine also.
http://www.youtube.com/v/sdvdFYVmjgM

Ummm....nope, I don't want to give him props at all. Not sure where you got that from. I simply corrected a statement you made. One you based your whole argument off in fact.




Black

[SKULLSPLITTER]

Don't even sweat it, Gandalf....several others here and myself know you're not trolling...we were just letting it slide....lol....I don't know why, but the boys are trying to perform some kind of revisionist renaissance with that unprofessional, overtouted, underskilled fake fuck I nailed 5 years ago...

Hatton was what he was....a low Boxing IQed, but spirited, British level champion who took advantage of his rabid fanbase and maximized his earnings....his resume was EXTREMELY padded...he didn't even fight the best comp in his own country (Witter) at the time...

Warren paid a one foot out the door Tszyu to come over and take it in the ass, and he cruised off that monumentally disgusting win for YEARS...he was given the decision against Collazo so he could straight up SELL his 0 to Mayweather...he was a big fat cherry, and he knew it...then, he made even MORE money off his foolish fans by getting the Pacquiao paycheck he didn't deserve...

That is all entirely accurate and written in stone...people wanna say, "but he only lost to the best!"...when the thing is, he only came over and fought the best after NEARLY 40 FIGHTS, and it was STRICTLY for the money...if he went life and death with Collazos and Lazcanos, how was he supposed to beat ELITE level fighters?...he knew that...

Manchester, hooligans....all "firty free fousand" of his blind, travelling fans...."ayyyy....I'm like you...love me beer and darts and me bangers and mash...buy me brand and bet your house!....BLUE MOOOOON on iTunes!"

lol....fuck that noise.


In his career high performance, and this says it all, Ricky Hatton had to CHEAT to win...at home...with his family friend, Dave Parris, as the ref...

I've gone over this and proven myself right so many times it's overkill, so I'm purposely leaving shit out on purpose....but don't give Hatton a pass, boys...because that means he pulled the wool over your eyes TOO....there are so many worthy warriors out there who never landed a substantial, let alone HUGE, paycheck and died broke....while that fraud's fuckin' set for life...


There ya go...lol...you may have sucked me in...but don't expect any counters...

I'm walkin' off...

[blackbelt2003]

LOL, CEO, I WISH you would find someone new to hate as much as Hatton. That level of hate is priceless, and I miss it. Are there any better haters on ANY board than you and Stevenski?


Or are you both mellowing in old age?




Black